Srila Prabhupada, His Movement & You

From Sachisuta das,
irmingham, West Midlands, UK
13 February 1994

My dear Hansadutta Prabhu:

Hare Krishna. Please accept my obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Have just finished reading your publication of 1993, Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You.

Having read your letter to Nityananda Prabhu (dated July, 1992) a little while ago in VVR No. 18, September ’92, in regards to your reply you received from Bhurijana Prabhu regarding your request for excommunication to be lifted, I was thinking to write you then. As a few of us Nama Hatta members attached to Birmingham, West Midlands ISKCON temple were still struggling with many dilemmas regarding acceptance of rittvik acharyas, etc., with our minds and ISKCON authorities, etc., I wasn’t sure how or when to contact you, so left it for a while.

However, after noting carefully your “Apology to the Devotees,” “Letter to a Devotee Friend,” “Introduction,” “Letter to New Initiates,” etc., etc., I was moved to write immediately, as it is most evident that now you are back, and are determined to return ISKCON to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada, many sincere devotees world-wide will be eager to correspond with you, so perhaps before you are inundated with letters, etc., perhaps you may have time to write us a group letter? (Please do not feel obliged, however, although we would eagerly await). I think perhaps ISKCON GBC may rue the day they didn’t grab you back when opportunity arose, for as you are now in complete understanding of Srila Prabhupada as Sampradaya Acharya and at your own position as his designated representative (July 9th, 1977 letter), and as you are first of “original eleven” (and aware of your preaching ability from the early days, German carts and Dr. Kovoor episode, etc.), who has returned back to Srila Prabhupada’s lotus feet, I think reconciliation is now imminent.

My own “just initiation” ceremony was through Jayatirtha, 1980, yet even then I felt more attached to Srila Prabhupada, even though I was always living at home with wife and children, etc., having never lived in temple, although it took until middle of 1993 before I fully understood I was actually Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. This came about after approaching one of our members here, Krishna Kantha Prabhu, who was first to contact Puranjana Prabhu regarding rittvik. When His Holiness Shivarama Swami GBC found out he was offering his findings to us, he informed ISKCON temples to ban him, so we all decided to have our programs away from Birmingham temple until such time ban is lifted.

We are currently in possession of 22-page paper from ISKCON Birmingham temple president, Govinda Bhasya Prabhu, covering many scriptural quotes and observations, and when he returns from India in March, we are invited to openly discuss issues, to some conclusion, hopefully. As he is taking initiation (third time) from Gour Govinda Maharaja on Lord Nityananda’s appearance day, and accepting him as Guru Maharaja, his mind is already made up, so maybe little point in discussing?

So Prabhu, much to say how most pleased we are to see that you have triumphed over a diversity (hell and back, etc.), but will contain for now. Thank you so much for the enormous encouragement it is to us that you are with us. Very soon now Srila Prabhupada’s ISKCON will be back with him, then all success assured. We would be most grateful for any instruction and advice, etc. you can give.

Your well-wisher,
Sachisuta das

Jai hari bol

P.S. Prabhu, I hope I have not been too familiar in this? For it may be that you are due more respect now than before, as it cannot have been easy to adopt lowly position. Only Prabhupada and Krishna know what’s in our heart beyond externals, yet to have been honored with great pomp and ceremony, now to return to humble servant, shows much for your strength of character. Please forgive any offence.
Hare Krishna.


From Dinadayadri dasi,
Ferndale, Michigan
14 February 1994

Dear Hansadutta das:

Please accept my most humble obeisances. All glories to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada!

Thank you very much for your letter of February 9, 1994. Yes, I have been anxious to obtain several more copies of Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You. There are a few people I’ve wanted to loan my copy to, but didn’t, because I consider it so valuable and didn’t want to risk not getting it back. Please let me know how much the magazine costs (the one I have was a gift from Puranjana Prabhu), and I will place an order for five more.

Personally, I think everyone connected with Srila Prabhupada’s mission needs to read Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You. It is very powerful, because it presents the truth with logic and devotion, but without the type of inflammatory rhetoric I’ve seen elsewhere. I agree with you that “We must go forward positively,” but believe that all those who have falsely postured themselves as liberated souls and allowed others to think of them as such need to do as you have done, perhaps not so much to gain the forgiveness of we the assembled devotees, but to gain the forgiveness of Srila Prabhupada (the one who has been most grievously offended) and thus reopen their connection to the Brahma Gaudiya Vaishnava Sampradaya. Obviously the world is desperately in need of Krishna consciousness, and Srila Prabhupada’s mission is very much in need of leadership that can unite all the differing factions within it. Your approach is the only one I can see that has much chance of accomplishing this.

I hope all the ISKCON “gurus”, past and present, get the chance to read Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You. I would be very interested to hear if any of them have read it and what kind of reaction you are getting from them (positive, I hope). I am especially concerned about Bhagavan, because he opened my home temple here in Detroit, initiated me in early 1970 as a rittvik representative of Srila Prabhupada, and several of my closest friends eventually became his “disciples.” I also have a lot of affection for Kirtanananda, because he was always very kind and attentive to my parents when they visited New Vrindavana (which they did because they enjoyed it—I wasn’t even there) and he arranged for them to meet Srila Prabhupada on one of their visits.

I wish you all success in publishing your Inside Nama Hatta magazine. I have sent in the postcard I found in Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You for a subscription. As long as you continue to follow in the lotus footsteps of our beloved Srila Prabhupada, you have my full support. I pray this meets you in good health and happiness!

Your servant,
Dinadayadri dasi

This entry was posted in Godbrothers-Gaudiya Math, His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, Society of Devotees - Disciples of Srila Prabhupada, Spiritual Master and tagged , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

22 Responses to Srila Prabhupada, His Movement & You

  1. I shall be including sections of this very intelligent, but flawed, commentary in an upcoming article that will be posted on one of our websites. As I told you in 1988, I would read the book that you gave me. I have read, more than once, both of your books, as well as this article. You are close. The quote from Vaikunthanatha, as potent as it appears to be, is still evidence not conclusive proof. Indeed, and somewhat ironically, you have prominently posted in another section of your website, that famous letter you received from His Divine Grace wherein he said that his movement may have gurus given the title of Bhaktivedanta (for their advanced learning and realization in the supreme science) by 1975. This was not realized, however, as we all know. Instead, eleven men–yourself one of them–went, in your own words to me back in the Eighties “way too far.” Nevertheless, misuse of a great science does not render it useless. The rittvik process (and I spell this word exactly as you do, so we have something in common there) in relation to Srila Prabhupada ended on November 15, 1977; the last genuinely initiated disciple of Prabhupada was Mahapurana das, an African-American devotee, at (again, somewhat ironically, although Nityananda prabhu was already in Mississippi by that time) the New Orleans yatra just hours before Prabhupada departed us in manifest form. The real issue here is not rittvik; the real issue is “regular guru, that’s all.” What did that mean? I ask this rhetorically, as I am confident that I know what it means. Similarly, as was revealed in your presence at Topanga Canyon in early December of 1980, the eleven men named on July 9-10, 1977 where not to create any kind of exclusive monopoly based upon their having been given the renewal of the service of rittvik, which had been suspended for a period of time before that summer. I think that you would agree that close is not good enough here. We may put together the pieces of the puzzle in a different chronological order–and that is to be expected–but, when it is finished, all the pieces fit together in one way and one way only. There is one perfect way, and we both agree that the vitiated GBC has not established, nor does it represent, that way. Yet, there arguments have some power to them, especially in terms of pragmatic considerations–Western pragmatism, that is. Indeed, I pick up no dearth of pragmatism in your presentations both in your books and on your website. The issue is not pragmatism itself, as Prabhupada was very results oriented. The issue is the difference between Western pragmatism and Vedic or Vaishnava pragmatism. There is one essential difference between them, and a hint of what that is can be found in Nityananda prabhu’s favorite slogan: Satyam eva jayate.
    One other thing to keep in mind. Kindly do not misread anything personal into this, because it is not intended for any specific initiated devotee (1966-1977) of Prabhupada. We both agree that the GBCs of Prabhupada and his guru deviated in egregious ways. What was the ultimate result thirty years after the first such deviation? Or, rather, how did Lord Chaitanya choose to rectify that situation? It wasn’t via any kind of rittvik arrangement, was it.
    So, I am being stimulated to some extent by what I am reading on your website and in reviewing your books (I have both of them) once again. In due course, it should produce an article that goes into detail on all of these spiritual raw nerve topics. Obviously, I had very little association with His Divine Grace in comparison to your good self; I was only alone with him once for about four minutes. So, you are very blessed, and I admire your spiritual good fortune. It empowers you to carry on, no doubt. Still, you and I have another thing in common that is certainly rare amongst Prabhupada’s actually initiated disciples, viz., neither of us was preached to before coming to the temple and deciding to surrender. I have read your historical account, it was impressive, and I could relate to it. Mine was different, obviously, but the principle was the same. As such, we each stand for something and push something independent of mass opinion and negativity of the enforced conformity. Your version of rittvik–and there are quite a number of them–is different from the others, and that is to be expected, also.
    Once I produce the above-mentioned article (for the first time, I am seriously considering employing the A & A format in doing so), would you like me to notify you of its posting along with a hyperlink? I shall not be offended if you answer this specific query in the negative nor shall I be offended if I do not hear from you at all. We are all meant to reach the stage of sthita-prajna, in which it is certain that His Divine Grace would order us to become diksa-guru, not rittvik. Until then, we are meant to preach to newcomers, stress Prabhupada as their siksa-guru, and keep them in the process at the level of sadhu-sanga. It is an impetus to get very sincere and serious and reach the stage of mahimni sve mahiyate, i.e., drsta evatmanisvare. If we could not or cannot reach even this stage, which is prior to bhava, then what was the meaning of Srila Prabhupada coming here in the first place and training us to become gurus? And he certainly wanted this, as you well know, and as evidenced, if not indeed proved, by his letter to you in 1975.
    Hoping that this meets you and your good wife in good health and cheerful mood, I beg to remain . . .
    Your eternal servant,
    KAILASA CANDRA DASA

  2. Pingback: Srila Prabhupada, His Movement & You « The Hare Krishna Movement

  3. Suvarna says:

    Thank you for this book Hansadutta Prabhu. Very wonderful writing. I am very grateful. Thank you. Your servant Suvarna

  4. Suvarna says:

    is this book available to purchase?

  5. I have no motre copies for saler, you can download the whole text from Nama Hatta, or write to daschan@streamyx.com…… perhaps they have a copy,
    Thank you nfor appriociating my realizations. I do not write for money, or noteriety. I have written according to my experience and heart felt love for Prabhupada

    Your humble servant,
    I shaould have done better,
    But I fell. failed and am very repentant about that, and still working to get up and do the right thing.

    • tarunkrishna das says:

      Haribol ji, may i say Hansdutta ji at least you have said you made mistakes , been open about what went wrong for you, not many from that time have or ever will,..so bless you ji ,..haribol

    • Nilesh Dalal says:

      Hare Krishna prabhuji,
      Please consider to reprint your book not for fame or for glory but to help other innocent jivas from following the bogus gurus. I just discovered your website. But there are others where this message has to be reached. Please help to redirect Prabhupada’s vision in it’s true direction. Senior true devotees like yourself is our only link to the truth.
      Hari Bol.

    • dhaval moradiya says:

      hare krishna
      i want to purchasse of this book …

  6. Martin says:

    Hare Krishna. Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

    For many years I have been searching for the audio of the so-called appointment tape of May 28, 1977. Do you have the audio file, and if so, could you please email it to me or post it to YouTube? I have read the transcript and understand that Srila Prabhupada appointed ritviks, but I would like to hear the audio for myself.

  7. William Regular says:

    Hare Krishna!!
    Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

    Thank you very much for your profound realizations. i really felt indebted.. it gives me more light since you personally advice me to read first before i come to visit any ISKCON temple. i will write you someday in regards of this book.
    Again, thank you very much Hansadutta Prabhu

  8. Pingback: Disappearance day of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada « Srila Prabhupada

  9. Lou says:

    Dear Hansadutta Das,
    I remember you in Berkely in 1976 or so. I used to frequent the temple there often. I have not been to an ISKCON temple since then although I occasionally try to keep up on ISKCON news. I am a devotee of Avatar Meher Baba. I have no qualifications to judge but the letter you’ve shared seems to clearly spell out Srila Prabhupada’s wishes. It makes it very clear: “The newly initiated devotees are disciples of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada …” It is truly a shame that ISKCON has been divided all these years and I pray your efforts are helpful. Congratulations on your honesty and sincere work.

  10. Probir saha says:

    Jay radha!! I love “krishna” but i love you too.,’prabhupada’

  11. Vishnujana says:

    Hansadutta please accept my humble obeisances as a older Godbrother. I would like to talk to you about the ritvik system and where do you stand with post 1977 ISKCON. I would also like to know if you yourself know about the poisoning of our Spiritual Master A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada by your Godbrothers (perhaps you were aware but did not do anything) as well as your Godbrothers and the heinous acts they have done such as kirtananda and bhakti thirtha and many others. Please write back to me as soon as possible. If you truly following Srila Prabhupada you would allow for us to start a conversation to help this poor lost soul find some happiness. You are one of the last Ritvik Representative of Srila Prabhupada who was chosen by HIM. do not let this go to waste. Rise up Hansadutta and fight for Srila Prabhupada if you are sincere. Do not become clouded by illusion like arjuna at the battle of kurusetra with his family members. Just because they are your Godbrothers does not make it right to let them destroy Prabhupada ISKCON and take so many to hell with them. there are many scattered sects of the ritvik camp around the world with some truly devoted to Prabhupada and others for some materialistic purposes. Are we to let our faith become like the christian faith which is scattered from protestant to catholic to coptic orthodox to Pentecostal? Why do you sit and do nothing? Become a true ritvik and defend Prabhupada order and stop this second poisoning which is being done to Prabhupada Books. They are new devotees that are coming in this movement and many are lost because of the so many ritvik camps as well that they do not want to associate with ISKCON example my self and few friends. All I ask of you from my self is to write back to me so we may talk with my friends on your place and what we can do. Hare Krsna Jai Prabhupada.

    • Vishnujana says:

      Srila Prabhupada: Keu bole je keu poison kore diyeche. Hoy to tai.
      Translation: Someone says that I’ve been poisoned. It’s possible.

      Balaram Mishra (?): Hmm?

      Kaviraja: Kya farma rahe hain?
      Translation: What is he saying?

      Srila Prabhupada: Koi bolta hai je koi mujhko poison kiya gaya hai.
      Translation: Someone says that someone has given poison.

      Kaviraja: Kisko?
      Translation: To whom?

      Srila Prabhupada: Mujhko.
      Translation: To me.

      Kaviraja: Kaun bolta hai?
      Translation: Who said?

      Srila Prabhupada: Ye sab friends.
      Translation: These all friends.

      Bhakticharu: Ke boleche, Srila Prabhupada?
      Translation: Who said, Srila Prabhupada?

      Srila Prabhupada: Ke boleche.
      Translation: They all say.

      Tamal Krishna: Krishna das?

      Kaviraja: Ao ko kaun poison dega? Kis liye dega?
      Translation: Who would give you poison? Why would anyone do that?

      Tamal Krishna: Who said that, Srila Prabhupada?

      Srila Prabhupada: I do not know, but it is said.

      Exchange 1 – Mixture of English, Hindi and Bengali (9/11/77)

      Jagadisha: Srila Prabhupada, can you tell us why you want to go on the parikrama? (travelling to visiting holy places)
      Prabhupada: …good paddy.
      Tamala Krsna: This seems like suicide, Srila Prabhupada, this program. It seems to some of us like it’s suicidal.
      Prabhupada: And this is also suicidal.
      Tamala Krsna: Hm. Prabhupada said, “And this is also suicide.” Now you have to choose which suicide.
      Prabhupada: The Ravana (A great demon) will kill and Rama (God) will kill. Better to be killed by Rama. Eh? That Marica–if he does not go to mislead Sita, he’ll be killed by Ravana; and if he goes to be killed by Rama, then it is better.
      [Room Con. Nov. 10, 1977, Vrndavana, India]

      Prabhupada: All right. You take Babaji Maharaja. That will be my going. (“devotees” laugh)
      Krsna dasa Babaji: Jaya. (laughter)
      Tamala Krsna: Yes, the bullock cart will go tomorrow
      Prabhupada: Yes.
      Tamala Krsna: To Govardhana.
      Prabhupada: Yes, other devotees can go. I cannot go.
      Tamala Krsna: No, they’ll go on your behalf, but you will go one day. That we promise you. (“devotees” laugh)
      “Devotee ?”: (under breath) Sati (other “devotees” laugh)
      Prabhupada: All right.
      Tamala Krsna: Our greatest pleasure will be to take you on tirtha-yatra, Srila Prabhupada. We wanted so much to go with you on that.
      Prabhupada: Thank you very much.

      (Vrindavana, India – 10th November 1977)
      http://www.prabhupada.org.uk/paul/08.mp3

      here is the conversation of his final days. You were there werent you? therefore if you knew of this publicly repent and work to fight against your “Godbrothers” and if you sincerely and honestly did not know then research and hear what they did to our Guru Maharaj and understand what you must do.
      http://www.prabhupada.org.uk/paul/prabhupada_poisoned.htm

  12. Krishna Tungal says:

    All Glories to Srila Prabhupada,
    Hare Krishna to all the devotees.

    What Vishnujana Prabhu said is 100000% true. Hansadutta Prabhu, you can do it, we all here to support you..

    HariBol….

    Your servant
    Krishna Tungal

    • Aaca says:

      Dear Jagaddharta Prabhu Thank you for your comments. I beelive that you are correct in your appraisal that we have underestimated world affairs as a causative influence. Srila Prabhupada has given us all the knowledge and perspective to understand the complexities of modern life and how we are entangled in the modes and more importantly how to get disentangled. Srila Prabhupada gives us the tools it is up to us how or when or if we employ them. He nor Krsna will do this as this is our duty to free ourselves. The Demon Kali has his agents both outside and inside of FISKCON. To have them inside ISKCON is impossible for inside ISKCON is where Srila Prabhupada’s vision lies illuminating the absolute truth. FISKCON adherents do not have this vision and so they will cheat us. It is only when we can understand this difference, that is between ISKCON and FISKCON that we can begin to free ourselves. Yes no one comes close to Srila Prabhupada! Nor are they meant to. He is the Acharya of ISKCON no one else. We have to all come together by aligning our visions to his and in order to do this we must understand our predicament within the Geopolitical sphere and to know where the Krsna Consciousness Movement is being compromised, where our own vision has been affected and obscured. Yours in the service of Srila PrabhupadaAdmin

  13. Pingback: Srila Prabhupada, His Movement and You « The Hare Krishna Movement

  14. Pingback: Biography of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur | KRSNA Insight

  15. Pingback: Ekalavya then and now | KRSNA Insight

  16. Hansadutta Prabhu, you are in an excellent position to understand the ritvik issue because you were an ISKCON temple president, a member of the GBC body, a BBT trustee, an “appointed guru,” and a “zonal acharya.” Your booklet is what convinced me, even before “The Final Order” was published.

    Also, no ISKCON leader dares to debate with you. All that they ever do is resort to low-class name-calling!

  17. hansadutta das says:
    September 12, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    I have no motre copies for saler

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <s> <strike> <strong>